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Lyme Disease ForumsGeneral & SupportWhich Lyme tests are most accurate?
06/23/2012 05:57 PM
MigraineGrl2
MigraineGrl2
 
Posts: 43
Member

Hi all,

My name is Kristen and after struggling for 5 years with severe migraines, a Dr. tested me and found that my Immunity is extremely low. She has ordered a test for Lyme Disease as nearly all of my symptoms would fit that criteria. However, after doing my own research online, it seems she has ordered the least reliable of the Lyme tests (the CD57)?

So i'm wondering if anyone can shed any light on the most reliable Lyme tests to get? I am new to all of this and was just told 2 days ago that I probably have Lyme, so i'm stressed to the max and I need to ensure that the test i'm getting to confirm if i am positive for Lyme is actually an accurate test or not.

Also, I am currently in Florida (Tampa Bay Area). I know there is the theory that "Lyme doesn't exist in FL" (idiots...lol), but I have only lived here for a year and I am from Massachusetts where I would have been exposed to Lyme (if i have it) as a child (I am 28. Migraines began at 23).

If anyone knows of any Lyme literate doctor's in FL, please please message me. I really do not want to be treated incorrectly!

Thank you so much everyone. I am SO incredibly sorry that all of you have to deal with this horrific disease. I am a mess right now thinking about the possibility that i have this and what damage it has done to my brain (migraines daily for 5yrs, severe memory loss, lack of coordination at times).

Hang in there, you are all so strong!

Kristen

Reply

06/24/2012 01:33 AM  Top
Bettyg
 
Posts: 26519
VIP Member
I'm an Advocate

hi kristen,

most accurate to date is this:

go to TIPS FORUM, right above here, click on forums,

tips is half way down,

either as a STICKY PIN OR GO TO INDEX AND LOOK FOR THIS:

blood testing labs; i have named them all i am aware of.

i'd go to the VERY BOTTOM and look for:

ADVANCED LAB SERVICES or the last 2 words are turned around in penn i think.

$600 is supposed to be the no. 1 testing accurately now.

otherwise, igenex lab in calif. has western blot igm/igg for $200 OUT OF POCKET unless you are on medicare!

do you know if you have CO-INFECTIONS, OTHER DISEASES ticks/etc. carry?

in my welcome letter link below, read dr. corson's KID'S EVALUATION where she goes thru the entire body and tells WHICH DISEASES effect every body part. you'll know towards end if you have CO-INFECTIONS TOO AND WHICH ONES!!

my blood lab post has many details there to read. hope this has helped you.

hugs/prayers,

bettyg, iowa activist

********************

in case i missed you, below is what i send to all who come here.

please post in LLMD REQUEST FORUM, ANSWER ALL QUESTIONS ASKED using my posting guidelines of SHORT paragraphs please.

Welcome to MD JUNCTION! I'm so glad you found us! You’ve come to the right place for education and support!

Private messages DELETED in 30 days!

ARCHIVE, upper right!

My WELCOME LETTER is posted at the top of SUPPORT FORUM in sticky pin full of good info and HYPERLINKS ready to be read.

http://www.mdjunction.com/forums/lyme-disease-support- forums/general-support/2356916-bettygs-welcome-letter-wgood- beginner-links-

The most important things are at the top; MUST READ and print off as mentioned there already to start your lyme/co-infection journey with us all.

The 1st things to do are:

• JOIN LYME BOARD;

• Post in LLMD REQUEST FORUM for a LYME LITERATE md; see my welcome letter and the INSTRUCTIONS there if you are SPECIALLY FROM CALIF. Where it’s broken down into 8 NAMED AREAS.

• You’ll need to give me my calif. NAMED area where you live in the areas shown there in SUBJECT LINE plus if it’s for ADULT or a child; we need age of CHILD; some llmds have AGE restrictions.

• OTHER STATES will show the SPECIFIC NAME OF THEIR STATE and Qclosest, largest city to them in SUBJECT line plus adult or child; UNDER 21; we need their age!.

http://www.mdjunction.com/forums/lyme-disease-support- forums/llmd-info/Itemid=217/func=post/do=reply

• Also, we’ll need the following info in your request post:

in your llmd request, please EDIT and add more info ok.

Are you UNDER AGE 21;; if yes, I need your age shown as some of our llmds have AGE RESTRICTIONS; thanks!

how long you've been sick

if you've tested for lyme/co-infections;

which labs doing work for which specific test, etc.

did you have western blot igm/igg done by igenex?

if yes, what were the POSITIVE & INDETERMINDED numbers; NOT negatives.

thanks for understanding; just EDIT your post. you can find all by going to left MY DISCUSSIONS, click on it.

after you add more, a LEADER will send you names ok.

I RECENTLY RETIRED AFTER 6 LONG YRS. OF DOING THIS!

Betty’s suggested posting guidelines:

NO ALL CAPS POSTS; they are illegible to me/other neuro folks!

Many of members have neuro lyme, and it is hard to read long solid block text and be able to comprehend; example, me, 42 yrs. neuro chronic lyme, so we are UNABLE to comprehend and read. Thank you for helping us help YOU 

Please post in short paragraphs like you see below or look at a few other posts, but we neuro folks need them short.

1-2 sentences MAX per paragraph and hit ENTER TWICE to double space between each paragraph. We’ve lost our comprehension skills to read solid block text.

We neuros lose our train of thought if the sentence is broken up in the middle; so please keep an ENTIRE sentence together as ONE. hugs

For easier reading, please edit your post. You can break up your longer paragraphs into smaller paragraphs. Please hit

ENTER key twice after each paragraph.

Go to left hand corner; click edit send. Then go to bottom and click SUBSCRIBE TO THIS DISCUSSION.

Thank you for posting in a manner that makes it easier for all to read and help others.

Bettyg, Iowa activist FOREVER Wink

**************************

YES, be prepared to PAY UPFRONT!

i've heard of some requiring down payments; i wasn't aware of that one at all!!

very FEW accept insurance; why?

insurance co. allow 7 min. per patient; we can hardly say hello in that time!

you also have to follow INSURANCE'S GUIDELINES ON TREATMENTS, IDSA/infectious disease drs. socieity guidelines... BAD NEWS FOR US!

by NOT accepting insurance, they can practice ILADS/intl. lyme and associated disease lyme guidelines ... treating you longer than 4 wks. of antibiotics, herbals, and alternative therapeis.

they allow 30-60 min. appt; longer 1st time; you pay accordinatelly for those appts.

ACCEPTING INSURANCE; they get very little $$ to pay the staff/overhead of building/utilities, etc.

many call patients day before to make sure they will be there; MANY DO NOT SHOW UP NOR HAVE THE DECENCY TO CALL SAYING THEY ARE NOT COMING!!

they could get those close by to come in but NOT being called; they are OUT THE MONEY and having one hell of a time meeting the bills.

our LLMDS are NOT RICH by any means!!

i hope this answers your questions so you understand what THEY are going thru too.

hugs/prayers,

bettyg, Iowa activist forever

RETIRED llmd coordinator for 6 yrs working directly with these drs/former group leader

BettyG, IOWA ACTIVIST
RETIRED llmd coordinator of 6 yrs; group leader

NOTE: I DO "NOT" USE CHAT thanks!
**************************************

NO INFORMATION SHOULD BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE.
please see my WELCOME LETTER/BEGINNER'S LINKS with important links/info galore :)

http://www.mdjunction.com/forums/lyme-disease-support-forums/general-support/2356916-bettygs-welcome-letter-wgood-beginner-links-

Any information provided should not be used to take the place of advice from your personal physician or other professional.

Information on those sites is the opinion of those who publish the sites and is NOT necessarily that of BettyG.

43 yrs. chronic lyme; 35 yrs. misdiagnosed by 40-50 drs. unacceptable; see my profile for more.

06/24/2012 05:24 AM  Top
Bettyg
 
Posts: 26519
VIP Member
I'm an Advocate

here's something specific to what you are discussing above.

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi? ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=118324;p=0

TF

Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)

Member # 14183

posted 06-21-2012 05:47 PM

Advanced Labs is a culture test. That means that it grows whatever is in the blood sample.

In your case, it grew the lyme germ. So, there is no doubt about it, 100% positive that your daughter has lyme.

If a person gets a negative test, that is not 100% positive since it is possible that there weren't any lyme bacteria in the blood sample but the person still has lyme.

So, that's why the test is only 80% accurate--due to the false negative that is possible.

The positive is 100% accurate. You can't grow lyme if there is no lyme to grow. It's just like a throat or sinus culture. If it grows a particular germ, there is no question that the germ came from the patient.

Here is the explanation of the test according to the company:

http://www.advanced-lab.com/news/ borrelia_culture_update.php

pme

LymeNet Contributor

Member # 31621

posted 06-21-2012 08:15 PM

Docs office said that it meant that there is clearly an active infection. They want to wait until the other bloodtests come back before we decide a course of action. So no treatment yet

I

This was the first bloodiest that came back. I thought it would be the last and take the longest The docs office said that it was surprising it came back positive so quickly and about just how active the infection is.

Explains a lot

--------------------

Tick bite in 2006, bullseye rash, treated with 2 rounds of 2 weeks of doxy. (once in 2006, once in 2009)

Dx with chronic Lyme May 2011.

LLMD April 2012, Treating with omnicef/zith

Lots of supplements!

------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------

Posts: 450 | From Connecticut | Registered: Apr 2011 | IP: Logged |

Rumigirl

Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)

Member # 15091

posted 06-23-2012 12:57 AM

At least she will be in good hands! Please, please read the sticky about tick bite prevention at the top of Medical Questions. Given that you guys live in CT, you need to do EVERYTHING possible to prevent further tick bites. Even when you are on treatment, it is still a huge risk to get a further bite.

Onward and upward (I know many ups and downs along the way).

Garden

LymeNet Contributor

Member # 31671

posted 06-23-2012 05:48 PM

Thanks for sharing, sorry about the news. At least you know for sure now - my greatest fear was treating my kids without proof.

Dr J gave my older one the same test, with the same results.

LymeNet Contributor

Member # 31621

posted 06-23-2012 10:59 PM

Garden have you treated your oldest

I am now concerned about my other daughter

Ugh but marching forward

--------------------

Tick bite in 2006, bullseye rash, treated with 2 rounds of 2 weeks of doxy. (once in 2006, once in 2009)

Dx with chronic Lyme May 2011.

LLMD April 2012, Treating with omnicef/zith

Garden

LymeNet Contributor

Member # 31671

posted 06-24-2012 12:33 AM

-They are both being treated by Dr J

It's way past my bedtime now, but I can PM you her protocol if you are curious tomorrow.LymeNet Contributor

Member # 25489

posted 06-24-2012 07:03 AM

Hi pme:

When our daugher first saw Dr. J in May of 2010 I would say she continued to go down hill till Jan of 2011.

We had drug combos and babs would be better but lyme neuro worse. It was terrible as a parent (never mind our daugher) to see this and difficult to trust any MD after what we had gone through.

Fortunately we started to see improvement but from Jan 2011 to May 2011 (so one year) there was plenty going on with adverse reactions to meds, etc.

It is a long process.

Good luck and I hope your daughter is well soon, unfortunately it is long process.

Tim

© 1994-2011 The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey, Inc.

All Rights Reserved.

BettyG, IOWA ACTIVIST
RETIRED llmd coordinator of 6 yrs; group leader

NOTE: I DO "NOT" USE CHAT thanks!
**************************************

NO INFORMATION SHOULD BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE.
please see my WELCOME LETTER/BEGINNER'S LINKS with important links/info galore :)

http://www.mdjunction.com/forums/lyme-disease-support-forums/general-support/2356916-bettygs-welcome-letter-wgood-beginner-links-

Any information provided should not be used to take the place of advice from your personal physician or other professional.

Information on those sites is the opinion of those who publish the sites and is NOT necessarily that of BettyG.

43 yrs. chronic lyme; 35 yrs. misdiagnosed by 40-50 drs. unacceptable; see my profile for more.

06/24/2012 09:34 AM  Top
MigraineGrl2
MigraineGrl2
 
Posts: 43
Member

Thank you so much!!

06/24/2012 08:14 PM  Top
mysticthecat
mysticthecat
 
Posts: 1655
Group Leader

It's important for You to understand that lyme is a clinical diagnosis. It sounds like whomever ordered the CD57 knows a bit about lyme. If your CD57 is low it means you are fighting something and if the symptoms fit it could be lyme.

Maybe you should ask her to also order a western blot antibody test. There can be false negatives with it, especially if your immune system is shot. But the WB test from Igenex is better at detecting it.

If your immune system is shot and your WB test is negative, you can do an antibiotic challange test with a LLMD. This is where they give you abx and test your urine for antigens to the Bb bacteria.

The advanced labs test is great but its downside is you HAVE to be off all antimicrobials for 6 weeks before you have your blood draw.

Post edited by: mysticthecat, at: 06/24/2012 08:18 PM

I am not in the medical field and anything I say is simply my opinion and should not replace the advice of your doctor.

06/24/2012 09:33 PM  Top
MigraineGrl2
MigraineGrl2
 
Posts: 43
Member

Thanks, mystic. The thing is that we know my immune system is shot because that is what has triggered this whole mess. My adrenal was tested and that goes hand and hand with immunity and my immunity results were extremely low. So my Dr is already aware that i'm fighting something. So the CD57 test would be redundant to what we already know. It doesn't even test for Lyme. So aggravating. And the Dr isn't an LLMD, she's actually a Nurse Practitioner.

Honestly, the unreliability of the Lyme tests are really frustrating me. False negatives, False positives...what the heck is the point of the test if you cannot be sure the results are accurate? How can anyone really be sure?

My immunity is at 12. I don't have that much further to drop so that means I could test negative on the western blot test? Seriously, i'm going to scream.

What is an Antibiotic challenge?

I don't know what the advanced labs test is ? And what are antimicrobials?

Sorry, i feel like everyone is speaking in lyme code and i'm not well versed yet lol.

Thanks!


06/24/2012 10:26 PM  Top
Bettyg
 
Posts: 26519
VIP Member
I'm an Advocate

mg, read the link above i posted about advnced lab, go to their HOME site and read what they published there.

it ends with this comment...

CONTACT US!

As always, we appreciate your feedback and ideas. It is this type collaborative effort that will ensure that we continue to develop and deliver what is needed as quickly and efficiently as possible. Thank you!

Advanced Laboratory Services

501 Elmwood Avenue, Sharon Hill, PA 19079

Phone: (855) 238-4949 Fax: (855) 238-4946

questions@advanced-lab.com

www.advanced-lab.com

you have to be OFF ALL ANTIBIOTICS 4 WEEKS PRIOR!

BettyG, IOWA ACTIVIST
RETIRED llmd coordinator of 6 yrs; group leader

NOTE: I DO "NOT" USE CHAT thanks!
**************************************

NO INFORMATION SHOULD BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE.
please see my WELCOME LETTER/BEGINNER'S LINKS with important links/info galore :)

http://www.mdjunction.com/forums/lyme-disease-support-forums/general-support/2356916-bettygs-welcome-letter-wgood-beginner-links-

Any information provided should not be used to take the place of advice from your personal physician or other professional.

Information on those sites is the opinion of those who publish the sites and is NOT necessarily that of BettyG.

43 yrs. chronic lyme; 35 yrs. misdiagnosed by 40-50 drs. unacceptable; see my profile for more.

06/25/2012 07:38 AM  Top
MigraineGrl2
MigraineGrl2
 
Posts: 43
Member

Thank you, Betty.

So frustrated that I can't even find a doctor to test correctly for this!


06/25/2012 10:19 AM  Top
mysticthecat
mysticthecat
 
Posts: 1655
Group Leader

Yes. It's very strange that the tests are so innacurate and yet we still keep ordering them.

Antimocrobials= antibiotics (natural or prescription antibiotics must be avoided for 6 weeks prior to the advanced lab test). Advanced labs may not tell you that when you call them. But your LLMD will tell you that, once you get one

Your NP isn't completely off base in suggesting a CD57 test. It does give some information. Is your CD57 at 12 or a different test? The ILADS used to say low CD57 indicated lyme or aids, I think. But now they know that it can be low from other things.

The antibiotic challange test is when your LLMD gives you antibiotics to try and get antigens to the bacteria to show up in your urine. My son just recently went through this.

It's used by some LLMDs in people with negative WB's, very low CD57s and symptomatic of long-term LD.

Our LLMD says he gets 90% of people in my son's situation to test positive using his antibiotic challange.

Are you on a waiting list to see a LLMD yet? Get on one or two. In the mean time get your NP to do a WB test on your blood, so you have it when you see your LLMD. Igenex does the best WB test.

Post edited by: mysticthecat, at: 06/25/2012 10:20 AM

I am not in the medical field and anything I say is simply my opinion and should not replace the advice of your doctor.

06/25/2012 10:40 AM  Top
stephn
Posts: 48
Member

What other things can produce a low CD57? My CD57 is at 18 and my LLMD is going to start me on two weeks of Flagyl and Amoxicillian to see if I herx.
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